Podcast Trailer: How loss affects your workplace and why empathy matters

Grief costs American businesses upwards of $100 billion dollars a year.  This is a staggering number.  As an employer or a manager, how you help (or ignore) employees in crisis has a direct impact on your bottom line.  The trailer of the Handle with Care podcast unpacks this data and frames how you can help employees survive, stabilize, and thrive in the aftermath of disruption. 

You can listen to the entirety of the episode here. You can also find us on Spotify, Google Play, and iTunes:

Imagine the scenario, you’ve probably lived through something similar:  you hear that Mike on the finance team just got diagnosed with cancer.  You’ve done projects together and you both love the same sesame seed bagels in the break room.  And you like the same college football team.  You’re friends, kind of, and now he’s sick.  You care, but you’ve never had cancer and you don’t know what to do…or what to say.  Maybe he doesn’t want to talk about it, and you don’t want to say something stupid.  So you don’t do anything.  The next time there are bagels, you wait, avoiding Mike and the conversation.  Weeks go by, its feels awkward and confusing, and you wish you knew how to help.  Or maybe you’re Mike’s manager, and then it feels even worse, because you have no idea how to manage someone going through cancer. 

Cancer, a divorce, a new baby, these are all examples of disruptive life events and they are happening every day in companies, large and small, across America.  They directly affect productivity and we don’t know how to help. 

And this lack of empathy at work has an actual cost to the bottom line of companies.  In 2003, the Grief Recovery Institute did a study to look at the cost of grief to American businesses.  The study drew on responses from 25,000 people and looked at events from the death of a spouse to a denied promotion to the passing of a pet.  Workers suffered from a lack of focus; they took additional sick days and some even quit their jobs.  Overall, the cost of disruption to American businesses was estimated at $75.1 billion a year.  Adjusted for inflation, that is a cost, in 2019 dollars, of over $100 billion a year. 

We don’t know how to show empathy at work, and that is why I am starting the Handle with Care podcast. 

Each week, I welcome a guest who has lived through something hard.  They will share their story:  what they were thinking and feeling in the midst of disruption, sort of a behind-the-scenes look at pain their journey. 

Most of the time, we never get that story; we get just a glimpse.  And they will share the good, the bad, and the ugly stories of the ways that people supported them…and the ways that they were missed.  We will end each episode with some actionable tips for what you can do as a co-worker, a manager, or a friend to support someone going through a disruptive life event. 

When I talk about building empathy at work, the phrase has two parts.  First, on the Handle with Care podcast, we are specifically talking about empathy in the workplace.  Although there are definitely take-aways for life outside the workplace, most people spend more waking hours at work than they do at home and they bring these disruptive life events to work, whether they want to or not. 

Disruptive life events are already affecting your workplace, the question is whether you are proactively working to create support and stabilization or always playing catch up.  Second, empathy at work implies that empathy has to translate into meaningful action.  You can feel empathy, you can want to help, but until you put this empathy to work, it doesn’t accomplish much. 

Beyond the numbers, this podcast is birthed out of my personal experience.  I was 27, in the midst of an MBA program, preganat with our daughter, Mercy Joan.  At my tenty week scan, we found out that all was not right; she had a birth defect called an encephalocele. The base of her skull had not closed and doctors didn’t know:  could they operate, would this be terminal?  So, we waited and hoped.  I gave birth to her on February 15, 2011 and she died eight days later. 

Fast forward a few years to another disruption, when my youngest, a little guy named Moses, was born.  Moses has a heart defect called tetralogy of fallot with pulmonary atresia.  A normal heart has four valves, and you need all of them.  His heart was missing one valve entirely.  Without surgery, he wouldn’t be able to breathe on his own, he’d turn blue and die.  But, it is amazing what surgeons can do with the heart.  Moses is four and doing really well, but the last few years have been marked by hospital stays, uncertainty and multiple open-heart surgeries.

From the death of a daughter to the ongoing care of our son, I have experienced the deep comfort of caring co-workers, friends, and family, the people who were ready with a word of timely encouragement or an almond-milk latte, as well as the pain of the silence, absence, or just careless remarks of those that missed me.

So, if you want to become a better manager, a better co-worker, a better friend, this podcast is for you.  If you have lived through something awful, if you have struggled to put words to what you want or what you need, this podcast is also for you.  Through the stories that are shared and the lessons that we learn together, lets live out empathy at work.       

We are adopting a child: an interview with Beth and Andy Long

Adopting a child can be a long process, full of waiting and hoping and so much paperwork.  Friends, family, and coworkers can be unaware of the stress and high emotion involved.  Beth and Andy Long share the story of bringing Drew from the forest of the Democratic Republic of Congo to Bloomington, Indiana and the hardest six months of their lives.  In that story, they reflect on how people supported them well, the dangers of work/home compartmentalization, and the bravery it takes to create change in a workplace culture. 

 You can listen to the entirety of the interview here:

The Long family

Here are my three takeaways from my conversation with Andy and Beth

 1)    What are the implicit demands that your company makes on employees?  Have you stopped to wonder?  If not, now is a good time to ask.  Go ask a coworker or a direct report about how they think the company views time off.  And, call this lesson 1, part b, do you have established policies around time off and leave?  Andy and Beth were trailblazers in many ways, creating policies and precedent around NICU stays and adoption.  If you don’t have established policies, it’s time to get some things in writing.  As you create these policies, ponder, what kind of a culture do you want to create? 

2)    If you are going through the stress of an adoption or a prolonged hospital stay or any sort of substantial stress, coax yourself to be able to accept the help that is offered.  Taking your other children to play, receiving a delivery of groceries, it is good to be able to accept the help that is offered. 

3)    Beth talked about the world of adoption policy and news and updates that was “an entirely different language” than what was being spoken around her in southern Indiana.  If you are part of a support system for someone that is going through an adoption process, take time to ask them about the policy and the Facebook groups.  And then listen. Really listen. Andy and Beth spoke about how it was difficult for them to feel that some people close to them were not “in their corner” and rooting for the adoption to go forward, as you hear about difficulties or obstacles, before rushing to judgment and advice, instead consider offering a statement like, “I’m so sorry for that hassle!  That sounds complicated and difficult; I imagine that you just want to be united with your son or daughter as soon as possible.”  This sort of statement conveys empathy without pronouncing judgment.

Beth and Andy Long

If you want additional insights, here are some additional excerpts from the episode:

 There is so much paperwork

7:02 - Beth Long

Yes, so I mean every day, and I was sort of reporting back to Andy, but every day I'm online looking at the rumors talking about the chatter of what's going to happen. I heard this, you know the senator said this, I heard this from DRC. You know, everybody was just kind of putting the information together because like Andy said we really had no idea, we're going on rumors and tweets

The every-day reality of waiting

8:16 - Beth Long

Yes. So, we had a lot of online support as any sort of Facebook groups, but I think we had wonderful people in person, but you know how it's difficult to follow another person's health journey or you know their court dates. It's hard to keep all that straight. I'm using a whole different language when I'm talking about this adoption world. And so, there were definitely times when people were kind of like, oh you're, you're still doing that; you're still trying to bring that kid home? Yes, this is my daily reality. I'm daily still working on this every day is our son and every day we're thinking about it talking about it trying to figure out how I can make this happen.

Skepticism about the process feels hurtful

9:54 - Andy Long

And so, I felt like they maybe moved to, maybe be wary of the way that they approached it. They kind of didn't want to talk about it or ignored it. In some ways, because it felt like they were really nervous for us and we interpreted that as, they didn't care as much or they were skeptical, which I think they had every right to be because it was an indefinite suspension. They didn't know what was going on, neither did we. But it felt hurtful in the moment.

There is a danger in compartmentalization

19:04 - Andy Long

You know, looking back, I'm not sure how I did that or if I did a very good job. I probably suffered at work and wasn't aware of how distracted that I was. It felt like, maybe I probably was trying to do my best, but I would imagine if I look back now was probably very distracted and was underperforming. I think the part that suffered the most was home life because it's more difficult to turn off work and being on stage and you know trying to be pleasant, providing great customer service acting like everything is fine, leaving your problems at the door. I think I became very good at turning that off and when I was at work focusing on work, so that it became more difficult to engage when I came home to pick that back up and then engage with the problems and the difficulties that we had which became a major stress point for Beth and I. Probably the hardest thing that we've been through was my inability to say no to work or to change what I was doing there, which lasted for months and months probably six months.

Policies around disruption are important

22:01 - Andy Long

We didn't have real clear policies at work about, hey if you have a baby or if your family has a baby, this is what's normal to take off or these many days or this doesn't count against your vacation time or if you've got a medical emergency you know take this amount of time away from the office. We didn't have any of those policies really, really clearly stated at all and so then it was kind of, we were jumbling through it together where there was a lot of weird expectations on my side and I'm sure my co-workers at work needed me there and so they didn't really know how to process that or, you know, they, I'm sure would have liked to have me there more but they also understood it was inappropriate to ask me to come home or to skip some of that family time, so that I made it more difficult that we didn't have any clear policies on how much time I should take or what the procedure was for something like that like a medical emergency or traumatic birth.

Share how you are struggling

30:14 - Beth Long

And I think, also, one thing I wish that I would have done is just feel more comfortable to be, to tell people, this is how I'm struggling I feel, I actually later in the year started extreme problems sleeping. I started having chest pains and I felt like I was going crazy, which I think if I had just talked to people, they would say know that, you're experiencing anxiety and you probably should be based on your life circumstances right now. It took me slowly telling people small parts of that to put that all together, but I wish that I would have been braver with those emotions to say, hey here's what I'm experiencing.

I got injured and I won't be coming in to work: an interview with Liz Simpson

Injuries can leave employees sidelined and organizations flailing. As an employee recovers, is management demonstrating support and trust or neglect and suspicion? Liz Simpson shares the story of her laceration, the importance of communication and trustful gestures, and how NOT to deal with employees that are injured. 

For the entirety of the episode, please listen, rate and review the podcast at:

Liz Simpson

Also, don’t forget that we are in the midst of launch week giveaways from My Sugar Pie in Zionsville.  There are two different pies being given away and you can be entered to win…

1)     Rate AND review the podcast on iTunes.  Make sure to subscribe as well so you won’t miss any coming episodes

2)     Share a Handle with Care post on your social media feed this week to qualify for an additional chance to win.

I had three key takeaways from my conversation with Liz:

1)      Communication matters. As a manager or a co-worker or friend, your silence can speak volumes. When someone is injured, reach out with a call, a text, an email.

2)     Be sensitive to the emotions that an injured person might be feeling. Liz felt scared, worried about when and if she would ever recover. In showing that you're aware of their feelings, try offering a simple observation:  "This seems really hard. I imagine that it might be scary or overwhelming or sad..." When you say something like that, it gives the person a chance to respond or not to respond and shows that you are considering their feelings in the midst of an injury.

3)     Just a closing question. What assumptions do you make about people that are off work for injury? Do you believe them? Or, are you suddenly judging them? Wondering if they're making it up? Liz spoke about how hurtful these assumptions can be. Are you making them?

If you would like more of Liz’s reflections, here are some additional highlights from our conversation:

How you treat people at work matters

24:35 - Liz Simpson

You're at work more waking hours than you're at home. What are you going to do with the people that have been put there with you? What are you going to do with this? What are you going to make of it for people? Are you going to make people where they don't want to come in an hour? I mean I've had many days where I was when I, as this kept going on, there were so many days and I was like, "Oh thank god I cut my finger! Now I don't have to deal with them!" That's crazy! It's like, is this what you want for the people you've hired? Or do you want people who feel like this coworker was a godsend. You know, this person was there for me when I needed them.

Injuries are scary

10:18 – Liz Simpson

And it's very hard to calm down and say, OK, this was six days ago …and even if it had been my right hand you know the glove part would have been frustrating but just knowing like and even you know I like to paint I have other things I like to do and it's like everything I like to do. I need this to be working I need this to be 100 percent. So, it was sort of this moment of what is my life gonna be like now. And so that was that was scary

Empathy to coworkers is important

11:40 - Liz Simpson

I think a lot of times, because I've been in positions at a job where somebody has something happen and you're like, they're exaggerating. And I'm sure I had a job a while ago where somebody and, I mean, I hate to say supposedly, because I had something happen, but slipped and fell on some ice and then was off for a really long time with back pain. And I remember, we all were sort of like, yeah right, whatever. And so then, and you know I feel like I'm a Christian so I feel like God the Universe or whoever you believe in puts you in these situations, and for me, I think it's really helped me be a lot more empathetic because I remember so many days thinking back to that co-worker and thinking, Man I feel so bad. And I never I think, I probably reached out at some point but, do you know, for a very long time it was, yeah right. And now I was like, yeah, I'm in this position.

Reach out proactively in communication

16:23 – Liz Simpson

 That was the I was the only time I heard from him when I texted my manager and my boss December 4th or 5th or whatever day was say, "Hey I'm headed to the E.R." when I text them when I got out and was like, "Hey I'm gonna be off tomorrow you know with my because I have to keep my bandage dry for 24 hours" and I think when he wrote back that day like thanks for letting us know. I didn't hear from him again until February. In that email, and this is a person who's a fellow dentist, this person is my colleague, even if we never work again we're colleagues we have the same degree...and the very idea that you couldn't ever reach out on your own, not responding to something that I've sent to explain, like, I'm still off with another doctor's letter...not that, but just as a fellow human being as my colleague to say, "Hope you're getting better...never."

We bring our whole selves to the office

21:26 – Liz Simpson

We have this idea that you should be able to go to work and turn that off. And I think it's very American that it's like you're going to go to work and you're going to shut that off and you're going to take care listen produced for the night you're going to be produced for the next eight hours. And then when you hit the door you can then turn those emotions back on. And that is not real life for many people. There are people that can do that. Good for them. I'm not one of them and there's people who they get to work when they can get engrossed and everything and they are OK. But at some point, we have to say there are people who are going to be at work and may need to step up and cry about something or are going to have to be on the phone dealing with stuff the work will get done. And I think if you've taken the care to choose good people you won't have people that will take advantage of that.

My wife has cancer: an interview with Brad Grammer

A cancer diagnosis is scary and totalizing. Hospital visits, financial stress, and lingering uncertainty affect the entire family unit. Through Brad Grammer's story of walking with his wife (Laura) through leukemia, lessons emerge on how to support families well as they grapple with cancer.

Brad Grammer talks about his wife’s cancer treatments and his own journey with grief

 For the entirety of the episode, please listen to the podcast at:

Also, don’t forget that we are in the midst of launch week giveaways from My Sugar Pie in Zionsville.  There are two different pies being given away and you can be entered to win by

1)     Rate AND review the podcast on iTunes.  And make sure to subscribe as well so that you don’t miss any coming episodes

2)     Share a Handle with Care post on your social media feed this week to qualify for another chance to win.

My final takeaways from Brad’s interview were threefold.

1)     Find available support networks.  If you or someone you love is going through cancer, reach out to available support networks. Find a counselor or a support group. And if you don't know where to start, a great resource for those of you in Indianapolis is the Cancer Support Community. They are located off of 71 Street near Eagle Creek. And the Cancer Support Community offers free resources to those with cancer as well as their caregivers. There's a yoga studio, community gardens, cooking classes and one on one counseling available. The Cancer Support Community can be found online at cancersupportindy.org

2)     There are so many ways to help.  If someone in your office or community is journeying with cancer, there are so many ways to help. Organized meals, offer rides, give Starbucks gift cards or help to process those medical bills. Reach out and offer what is in your power to give.

3)     Beware of social niceties.  We so often default to easy clichés or trite phrases or giving advice when it's not actually wanted. Take more time to actually listen and weigh your words before offering canned comfort.

If you want more of Brad’s words of insight, here are some of the highlights from our conversation.

The immediate aftermath of a diagnosis can be a really chaotic time.

08:33- Brad Grammer

I think part of the shock of that is you don't get any time to think about it. Within two hours of being told we were in the hospital, you started treatment in the hospital. They told her she'd be there for 30 days that she wouldn't be able to work for a year. And me being the person who runs the finances of the home, I'm thinking I'm gonna have to sell my house because she made two thirds of the income.

Counseling is important

09:15- Brad Grammer

And for me, I'd have to go home and cry myself to sleep for a couple weeks. Fortunately, I was somebody who already understood the value of having a therapist in your life, somebody that you can trust to go to and talk. And so, I hadn't been to him in a while so I'm like well this is the time to go. So, I went to him.

It's time to back on the couch exactly because I learned, as an adult, an adult skill and many adults haven't learned this. But when you hit an area or a season of time that you don't know what to do, you ask for help just like what we teach our kids. If you don't know how to do this one task, then ask the adult to help you. Well, that's what we do as adults. Ideally, we should be asking for help when we're hitting a difficult season of life. So that's what I did.

As a caregiver, Brad learned that his mindset was really important

10:06- Brad Grammer

 I went to him (a counselor) and he asked me why I was cried myself to sleep at night and I was thinking about her dying, my wife, and how my kids are going to be affected. And so, he said, "Well do you want her to die?" "No!" I was offended that you asked that. Please clarify. "Well, you know Brad, she's alive today and you have her today so each day you can just take one day at a time and face the day and know that as long as she is alive, there is hope and you keep engaging and you never have to tell your boys about the possibility of dying even though she was getting a 20 percent chance to live."

 We just don't share that information with them; it's too much for kids to handle. It's hard enough for me as an adult to handle that. So, I took his advice. It was invaluable advice just to, because I didn't realize, I think...I don't know if it's an American way of living, but I didn't realize how much I'm living in the future before it comes. I was thinking, planning, what's coming next. And that experience forced me to face the moment, live in the moment today.

The importance of crying and support groups

15:04– Brad Grammer

You know the American mentality. I can pull myself by my own bootstraps and I can, I can, I can still make it. That's really important to, like, allow yourself to be weak and to cry and invite people into that life. There's got to be at least a couple people that you can invite into that. For some people who maybe don't have those kinds of relationships, what they find is having a support group for whether you've like, there's a there's a support group for people with leukemia and lymphoma and there for people with the disease as well as those that are caretakers.

They were, I didn't go for very long, but I just remember the great piece of advice that they gave us, like get away, take a break, go on a retreat by yourself. And I just couldn't do it because I was like, "But what if my wife dies while I'm away?" like I would just think. And they were just saying, you got to do it anyway. And they were like, at that moment it was a great piece of advice, I needed to get away.

17:18– Practical ways to help:  meals, rides, gifts, and health insurance

Meals

Brad Grammer

It was really beautiful because both of our workplaces were jarred quite a bit by this. Because our work communities loved us and cared about us as a family as well as individuals. And so, one thing that they did, it was just so amazing, is that both my wife's workplace and my workplace appointed, they had an appointed person and so if I needed anything, I called one of those people and said hey I need this. And that's all I had to do, and they would set off and contact people to do whatever, whether and they set up a meal plan. And this is a meal plan for a whole year wasn't just for two weeks when you're set up for a whole year.

Rides

Brad Grammer

She had to be either in the hospital every day or go to the hospital every day. So, if she wasn't, if she was at home then she needed a ride to the hospital. A lot of times, I could do it. But there are times I just couldn't drive, and Laura needs a ride. And that's a particular need and the fact that she just doesn't want anybody because she wants somebody that's comfortable with her throwing up in their car.

So, and you know, you want to feel comfortable with this person to some degree in order to throw up in their car.

House cleaning and gifts

Brad Grammer

Some ladies were so beautiful, they just would come and just clean my house. They didn't even ask me. They said, they would just say, "Hey, we're coming over this day and we're gonna come clean your house." It even, just, during the Christmas holiday season I had somebody just offer to do this and I said of course, and they just took the boys Christmas shopping for us as their parents. It felt so thoughtful.

Hospital Bills

Brad Grammer

One of the most amazing things this one person did is a lady that said, I don't, "I'm trying to figure out what I can do to support you. I thought I'm going to do what I'm good at." So, she normally is in H.R. and businesses and she said let me just handle all your medical bills. So, I would give all my medical bills to her, because unfortunately, you know insurance companies would deny a certain percentage naturally just because they're trying to not pay for everything. And so, they would deny bills that are meant to be covered by the insurance companies. So, she would handle all that problem and all she would do is, that like she'd hand me a bill and say pay this bill.

21:01- Learning to ask for help

Brad Grammer

You know, one thing I was thinking about is that I would communicate to people is what a friend of mine who actually is going through cancer treatment at that time...he was a pastor himself and told me to be sure and just tell people what you want. Anything. It doesn't have to be even a legitimate thing. If you want a gift card to Starbucks, just say so. You know, so like, I would ask for, you know gas cards because we were driving in the hospital all the time and they're quite far away from home. And then, or I just ask for Starbucks cards. I was set for Starbucks for a year.

23:16 – Stupid advice, comments, and small talk

Brad Grammer

There was, I think when my wife was sick with cancer, people come up with all kinds of things like, well you know you read that, like, if you just didn't drink too much milk...this will really help with the, you know, that cancer diminishing cancer cells and stuff. So, people come up with all kinds of ideas and they will offer that information without thinking, like maybe the person doesn't want to hear that information or maybe their information is very inaccurate and not helpful at all. And so, that can be kind of discouraging, just to have people kind of throw information at you without checking to see if you even want to hear it.

You know, I think, probably one of the things I would really encourage people to do is spend more time just asking questions and listening, just to find out what that person really would be encouraged by or benefited by. Maybe they don't get encouraged at all by giving advice about how to deal with your cancer. They just want you to listen and have somebody to cry with, you know.

26:12- The importance of listening

Brad Grammer

 And so, I think just really listening and hearing what a person's life is like each day can be way more valuable than giving any advice or asking questions like that. That's, I think, for me where people most miss. They assume, maybe, that you're, you're dealing with it better than you are and there's an assumption that, that you could have just a normal conversation when, in actuality, it's hard for you to even have a normal conversation. And the best thing you could do is just ask questions and listen.

27:31- Tell your story

Brad Grammer

There’re quite a few things. I was actually thinking even just this conversation with you this morning is healing because even though there's so many things that have been years later, just to be able to look back and talk about it is very encouraging. It's part of life.

31:58- It takes time to heal

Brad Grammer

And also, not putting a time limit on when I need to heal. I think that stresses some people out as they feel like they need to be healed within three to six months or something. And sometimes it takes years to recover from something and that's OK. I mean, our culture does not have patience for people and does not respect that. But to honor being a human being you must respect the fact that there are some things that just take a long time to heal from and it's OK. Yeah. You don't have to shame yourself for that.

32:35- The perils of small talk

Brad Grammer

Because we don't really have any guidance or education on these things. People don't know how to handle it. And so, they every time somebody sees you, they'll ask you how are things going. And some days that'll just trigger, you know, like I feel horrible. I feel like I'm going to die, and I want to punch you right now.

34:20– Learn to ask better good questions

Brad Grammer

Exactly and, like, and be able to equip people with different kinds of questions is, is important on a social interaction. But we don't, where did we learn that skill? It's not like you really have somebody who will teach you that. But ideally, it would be great if, if there's somebody that could teach us like, OK when somebody with a really hard time, these questions are actually better, yeah, then the social niceties that don't work. Like the social niceties, what they come across as is belittling the person's life and making it seem like it's manageable when that person feels like my life is not manageable. I am out of control. I feel horrible and not feeling that they're free to say that.

35:47- Get a therapist and go to a support group

Brad Grammer

I would say definitely go to a therapist or go to a support group for the thing that you're going through. You don't realize how important that is, just to have a listening ear, a compassionate response, somebody who can say, "Oh me too I'm going through the same thing," how invaluable that is.

36:23- Ask people for help

Brad Grammer

So, it's really important to always pursue people ask for help. Don't try and be the independent, I can handle this myself. That will not get you through this time at all. It'll only create problems for you later if not immediately. So always seek out help.

Brad Grammer

Countdown to podcast launch: 5 days to go!

We want to help people that are going through hard times, but it can be SO hard to know what to do or what to say, especially in the workplace! 

So...I'm launching a podcast next Monday, May 13. On each episode of Handle with Care, I welcome a guest that has lived through a disruptive life event. We cover topics from death to divorce to that scary diagnosis and, in each story, we give you actionable tips on what you can do to show empathy and give support as a manager, a coworker, or a friend. 

In our first three episodes, guests speak about workplace injury, a spouse’s cancer diagnosis, and the death of a parent.

Also, during launch week, we are going to have some fun (and tasty) give aways. So make sure to tune in. Five days to go…