A New Normal: Char Simpson on life after the death of her soulmate

Char Simpson, aka “Traveling Black Widow”

My guest today is Char Simpson.  To her many Instagram followers, she is known as the Traveling Black Widow, an older, beautiful Black woman traveling the world…or traveling regionally during COVID, offering tips on great gifts to buy or personal health or the best places to eat in Nashville. 

Char is classy with a little hint of sassy.  And in this episode, she is going deep, telling us about the love of her life, her soulmate, husband, and travel partner, Roy:  what she loved about him and what is was like to walk with him through cancer, to bury him, and to live, fully, a life she never would have chosen for herself. 

You can find the Handle with Care: Empathy at Work podcast on Google Play, Spotify, and Apple Podcasts. And you can listen to the episode here:

Char and Roy

There were so many nuggets of insight from today’s conversation, but here are 3 that I want to highlight as take-aways.

1. Listen and then act.  I loved the story that Char shared about the men that came to rake her leaves.  This sort of attuned, meaningful action comes through careful attention:  identifying a need and then showing up to meet it.  Where are places that you can show up, metaphorical rake-in-hand, to make a difference for someone that is going through a hard time?

2. Your empathy needs to be attuned and adaptive to the person in front of you.  Not everyone wants to be asked how they are doing.  Char shared about how this left her crying and suddenly swamped by emotion in places like Target.  Char appreciated a card or a compliment much more than the heavy, “How are you?”

3. Becoming a widow can be full of unexpected moments full of emotion:  the first cook-out invite where you are solo, the critter in the drywall that you don’t know how to deal with, the wife that begins to view you with suspicion because you no longer have a husband by your side.  If you are a friend of someone who is living as a widow, ask yourself how you might come alongside your friend with a kind word or an invite to a movie as they go through these ancillary losses. 

Enjoying her travels

Dead bunnies, COVID meltdowns, and other empathy failures: personal reflections from Liesel Mertes

I teach empathy because it matters, NOT because I am perfect at it. 

You will make mistakes; you will miss people.  I talk about some of my own “empathy misses” in this episode of the Handle with Care podcast…
How I went full-on Fix-It Frank when Bluebell the bunny was killed…

How Buck-Up Bobby reared his disapproving head when my son was sent home with a (potential) COVID-diagnosis… 

 The first step to cultivating meaningful change is to bring awareness to where you “go” during times of stress.

 I offer two other practical tips to help you interrogate your experience and build empathy in the episode.

 The Handle with Care podcast can be found on Google Play, Spotify, and Apple Podcasts. Or you can listen to the episode here:

Here are three key takeaways from the episode:

1. Sometimes we treat people who are further away from our sphere of influence better than we treat people who have a direct effect on our schedules and our workflow. So for me, it's way easier to show empathy and care if doing that doesn't affect or inconvenience the details of my life. But Magnus felt inconvenient. He was creating a lot more work for me, and I went right into a default response system.

2. interrogate your own experience when you find yourself going into these default behaviors, ask why am I treating this person this way?

3. If you have a tendency to be a Joking Julie or a Jackass Jared, you need to ask yourself some questions, beginning with, “Why am I so uncomfortable with my own emotions or with the emotions of others?”

He is a Gift and Every Day is Enough: Peter Kline and Janice McRandal on Cerebral Palsy

Peter, Janice, and Leo

In 21st century America, there is a sort of triumphalism to the birth announcement.  We cheer on a new life and assume that a healthy, “normal” baby will arrive nine months later. 

But the story often diverges, taking a detour through the NICU and into uncertain terrain.  In this episode of the Handle with Care podcast, Peter Kline and Janice McRandal share about their son, Leo, who has cerebral palsy.  

You will hear about the early delivery, the tumultuous first year, struggles with the feeding tube and the looming burden of uncertainty.  You will also hear their love for Leo and for each other, their journey into an affection of love-without-expectation.  There are also sharks, speeding tickets, and an Australian accent  

This is an episode for anyone that is in community with a parent of a special-needs child, it will help you deepen and expand ability to give care in ways that matter.  But, on a deeper level, it is an episode for all of us as we wrestle with and integrate how our 2020 story has taken us into unexpected terrain.  Peter and Janice offer wisdom for the journey. 

You can find to the Handle with Care podcast on Google Play, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. And you can listen to the episode here:

Leo, full of smiles

Here are three take-aways from my conversation with Peter and Janice:

1. Be very careful with clichés and looking on the bright side.  People toss out trite phrases because they, themselves, are profoundly uncomfortable with pain.  And we rush people to a good conclusion because it makes us feel better.  Janice and Peter both commented how painful it was to have people assure them, again and again, that everything would be just fine with Leo. 

2. There is a particular need for men to find and experience uplifting, emotionally accessible community as they go through hard times.  This is a need for women as well but, as Janice mentioned, women are much more prone to find each other while men are off on their own. If you are a man listening to this episode, think of someone in your circle who is going through something hard.  Give them a call, send a text, check in to see how they are doing and offer support. 

3. Support is both personal but there is also a structural aspect of supporting individuals and families that are not given equal access.  The level of care and intervention and support services that Leo needs is large and expensive.  And we need systems that make those services available and accessible.  If you are interested in joining your voice to advocacy efforts, I have linked the Arc and the American Disabilities Advocates below

Janice and Peter

The whole family

“So, no babies?”: Megan Flinn on survival and goodness

Megan Flinn: doctoral candidate, counselor, and founder of Hamza International Care

Motherhood is messily bound up in our concept of what it means to be female in the world.  This podcast episode probes into loss and femininity and post-traumatic growth…and how you can help someone going through this sort of pain. 

Megan Flinn lost her life-long hope of being a biological mother when her uterus was unexpectedly removed during surgery.  Her deep disappointment and wrestling profoundly impacts her work as a doctoral candidate, counselor, and non-profit founder.  “Survival and goodness is available, even in those dark places”  If you have experienced (or know someone who has) unexpected loss, this episode is for you. 

You can find the Handle with Care Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Google Play, and Spotify. And you can listen to the episode here:

Dog lover

Here are three key takeaways from my conversation with Megan

1. Just showing up matters…and your words can oftentimes get in the way of deep comfort.  Megan talked about the importance of the friend who just sat there, silently, with her as she cried.  In our hurry to “fix” grief and make things better, our talking often gets in the way of truly listening and being present.

2. If you are a manager or someone’s supervisor, make sure that you take the time to check in with them while they are away on sick leave.  And this check-in shouldn’t just be about work projects or getting on the same page regarding clients.  Set a time in your calendar to call or the visit just to hold space for hearing about how they are actually doing.  Megan’s managers never checked in with her while she was away…and she felt that gap.

3. Be careful how you talk to and about women regarding their reproductive choices.  We make so many flippant comments, asking women when they are going to start a family or if they are having any more children.  This is tenuous territory.  You never know the story behind what you can see.  And so much of society has, historically, bound the value of being female to being able to reproduce.  Avoid these minefields.  Stop asking unless someone offers you information.  And if you want to go deeper, consider your own biases and culturally conditioned conceptions of what it means to embody femininity.  After hearing this episode, is there anything that you want to revisit or revise?

Elephant lover as well

My Son has an Autism Spectrum Disorder: An Interview with Chrissy Brack

Chrissy Brack

Did you know that 1 in every 54 children has an Autism Spectrum Disorder (ASD)? 

This means that you probably know a parent of a child with ASD.  What are the unique challenges that they face within their parenting journey?  What are outdated phrases and presuppositions that you should get rid of in conversation (no more “high” vs. “low” functioning)?  How can you be a friend and a support?

Chrissy Brack talks about her son Joe:  his needs, his gifts, and the way that parenting him has changed (and bettered) her as a person.  She also shares how parenting a child with special needs has particularly equipped her to weather the uncertainty of 2020. 

You can find the Handle with Care podcast on Spotify, Google Play, and Apple Podcasts. And you can listen to Chrissy’s episode here:

Chrissy and Joe (photo taken by Joe Brack)

Here are three key take-aways from my conversation with Chrissy:

1. Respect the boundaries of parents living with a child on the autism spectrum.  This is just an extension of the basic premise of respecting ALL parents and their boundaries, but it is especially important here.  Chrissy bravely puts the needs of her son first, realizing how central she is to his well-being.  But this sometimes means strong lines in social situations.  Respecting boundaries means that, if they choose to leave a play date early, you DON’T try to cajole them to stay or put on a guilt trip, “Do you really have to go?”  Instead, you say, “It was great to see you!” and leave it at that.

2. Bring food.  Food is such an immediate, necessary gesture of care.

3. Be a friend that listens, just listens, without judgment or having to make it better.  And, as you listen, remember that it is alight to have limits.  We all do and COVID has thrown us up against them, hard.  Don’t be afraid to look bravely at your limits and to imagine a new normal.

4. This is a sort of bonus point.  Chrissy mentioned online communities like Raising Children UnFundamentalist that I have linked below.  A supportive community matters.

The Fine Art of Waiting: Stacey Ballard on Chronic Illness

Stacey Ballard

Did you know that 40% of Americans live with a chronic illness?  This means that someone you work with, someone you live with, someone you love, is probably coping with chronic pain. 

I didn’t realize the scope (133 million Americans) until my interview with Stacey Ballard.  Stacey lives with multiple chronic conditions:  a life marked by medical emergencies, uncertainty, and trauma.  Stacey segued her pain into The Fine Art of Waiting, an artistic workbook designed to help those in a season of waiting (and isn’t that all of us, in the midst of COVID-19).

Her interview opens up the world of chronic pain…and how you can help someone who is living with a lifelong condition. 

You can find the Handle with Care: Empathy at Work podcast on Google Play, Apple Podcast, and Spotify. And you can listen to the episode here:

Stacey during a hospital stay

Here are three take-aways from my conversation with Stacey

1. As a person living with chronic pain, Stacey could often experience herself as a burden:  a financial burden, a logistical burden:  someone who would not get better.  My first-takeaway is just a question:  If you know someone that is living with chronic pain, are you subtly or explicitly reinforcing those messages?  Perhaps the messages are subtle.  Do you sigh loudly when they express bodily pain?  Roll your eyes?  Or do you give positive messages:  you are important, you are more than your pain, you have a place here. 

2. Offer to come along to doctor’s appointments, to take notes, to drive.  The flow of information can be overwhelming, and company is often appreciated.

3. If you are living with chronic pain, finding a support group can be really meaningful.  Perhaps that is locally or through the Internet.  Support groups can also be helpful to care providers as they shoulder a particular burden.  And, as Stacey noted, not all groups are created equal.  If the group isn’t working for you, don’t be afraid to move on and seek out another support group. 

4. And this is a last, bonus take-away.  If you don’t know what to say, “Tell me more,” is a great prompt.  Stacey noted the importance of this phrase.  You might have noticed that I unconsciously did this earlier in the interview.  I don’t know a lot about chronic pain…which meant that I didn’t really even know what to ask.  However, by just opening myself up to her story with an open-ended question, I learned a lot. 

Living with a rare, terminal disease: Dustin Kaehr and HATTR

Dustin Kaehr

Country star Tim McGraw wrote a song, “Live Like You Were Dying.”  But beyond the words of a country song, what would it REALLY look like to live each day with a profound awareness of your coming end?  

This is a question that Dustin Kaehr lives each day.  Dustin is a leadership and business coach, professional speaker, published author, and an entrepreneur.  And he is all of these things while living with a terminal disease, HATTR, that has no cure. 

HATTR is genetic, passed through his family line.  What is it like to live with this uncertainty?  To love and to raise children under this spectre?  How to let them know about his condition? 

Dustin shares about his journey towards meaning, his book, and his purpose in today’s episode. 

You can listen to the Handle with Care podcast on Apple Podcasts, Google Play, and Spotify. And you can listen to Dustin’s episode here:

The Kaehr Family

Here are three key takeaways from my conversation with Dustin

1. If you are struggling with a rare or incurable disease, finding community is important.  Dustin talked about how meaningful it is to be with people who get it, who are likewise fighting the same disease.  As Dustin said, “You are rare, but you are not alone.”  Whether it is through Facebook groups or communities through your research hospital, finding your people matters.  

2. Having staggered, honest conversations with your children matters.  Dustin shared about how he and his wife have navigated these conversations with their boys.  Whether you come to the same conclusions or different ones, keeping lines of communication open is so important, especially with children. 

3. If you are a manager, give people the space that they need at work.  Dustin talked about the importance of bosses that checked in with him, that allowed him flexibility when he needed to take time off or work from home.  This sort of open-handed support builds trust and powerfully manifests a supportive culture at work. 

Be Strong and Courageous: Teen Suicide and a Father’s Heart. An Interview with Wade Brown.

Joshua Brown

Joshua Brown was fourteen years old when he took his life.  His father, Wade Brown, shares about his athletic, gifted son, the shock of suicide, and the ripple effects of loss.  Counseling, meaningful physical reminders, and the support of a caring community are essential as he carries Joshua with him in 2020.  Wade also leads and manages a large team at GE and speaks about how mental health and emotional support are essential during COVID-19.

You can find the Handle with Care podcast on Google Play, Apple Podcasts, and Spotify. And you can listen to this episode here:

A reminder of Joshua

Here are three take-aways from my conversation with Wade

1. Showing up matters.  Go to the funeral, send the text, make the call.  Even if you don’t fully know what to do or say, your support matters.  And this is a sort of point 1b guidance.  When you show up, especially in the aftermath of someone committing suicide, try to be aware of appropriate boundaries on how and what you ask about.  Wade spoke to the pain of having someone pry into whether or not Joshua is bipolar.  And here is a bit of guidance.  Before asking a question, take a moment to interrogate yourself.  Are you asking about of your own curiosity or because you are actually trying to support the other person?  You might have noticed in this episode that I did not ask about the details of how Joshua committed suicide.  This was purposeful.  If someone is not offering those details, I choose not to root around for specifics.  Knowing the details of death does not have a material impact on how I can come alongside someone.  More than anything, it serves my own curiosity and could feel prying and invasive to the person I am in conversation with.  Take a moment to pause and reflect on why you are asking the question you are asking as you relate to a parent who has lost a child.  And if you blunder your way into a mistake, go back and apologize. 

2. When it comes to comfort, Wade offered a metaphor that was powerful and nuanced.  He talked about how there are marathoners and sprinters in the world of the grieving:  there are people that will be able to come alongside you with great intensity and then seem to fade away and there are those that are there for the long-haul.  It is with great maturity that Wade talks about how one is not better than the other and that recognizing people’s different capacities allowed him to not just feel confused by those that seemed to be present than then fade away. 

3. Cultures of support are essential to helping your team thrive.  Wade noted several times that everyone has their Joshua:  everyone has a pain that they carry into their workplace.  Through his loss, Wade began to cultivate a purposeful openness and culture of support in his team at GE…and he attributes this openness to significantly contributing to his team’s ability to weather the challenges of COVID-19. 

An anchoring thought on the fridge

Wade and his older son, Jonathan

How can I honor her? Jason Seiden on life and meaning after his daughter’s suicide

Jason and Elle

Jason Seiden joins me to talk about his daughter Elle.  Elle was insightful and creative and she is dead.  She committed suicide after suffering from debilitating pain due to CRPS (complex regional pain syndrome) diagnosis and committed suicide at fifteen years old.  What does it mean to honor her legacy, to remember her in all her fullness?  What does it mean as a father to live a life that encompasses such a profound loss but is not ultimately defined by that pain? 

You can find the Handle with Care podcast on Apple Podcasts, Google Play, and Spotify. And you can listen to the episode here:

Here are three reflections from my conversation with Jason.

1. Even if you aren’t sure of what to do or say, move towards people in their grief.  In his words, “Live your life, make the damn mistake,”.  You won’t be perfect and you don’t have to be but your support matters.

2. If you are in a workplace setting with a parent that has lost a child, especially as a manager, make time to actually check-in with them, not just as an entrée to a meeting, ticking a box so you can get on with an agenda item.  This might mean scheduling a call or a meeting that isn’t about a to-do list but only about hearing from them about their how they are doing. 

3. Navigating life after the loss of a child is hard.  Jason expresses the complex, internal challenge of moving forward, of not letting himself be singularly defined by Elle’s death.  Sometimes it can feel sacrilegious or selfish as he leans into life beyond his daughter, struggling to be and become himself even after tragedy.  If you are struggling in this journey, perhaps you find camaraderie in Jason’s reflections.  And if you know someone who has lost a child, perhaps this gives you additional insight.  

Live True, Be Happy #promotelove

Racism, Loss, and Living while Black: an interview with Fred Brown

Fred Brown, CEO of the Forbes Fund

“I cry on the inside”

 Fred Brown is the CEO of the Forbes Fund.  He is also a power-lifter, change advocate, and the father of six children. 

 In this episode of the Handle with Care podcast, Fred ushers listeners into his experience as a Black man in America, delving into his personal losses, reflecting on the murder of George Floyd, and talking about the head trip of anti-black racism that caused him to question himself over the years as he advocated for meaningful, systemic change.  

His story is compelling, immediate and important.  You can find the Handle with Care podcast on Google Play, Apple Podcasts, and Spotify. Or you can listen here

Here are three key takeaways from my conversation with Fred

1. Systemic racism in America is real, insidious, and persistent.  Fred talked about personal grief over the state of things, the way that systems, whether that was the probation system or family reunification system, were established and maintained in ways that hurt lower-income black men, women, and children.  I have not been wounded by these systems, but it is important for me to listen to the stories of those that have, to believe them, and to advocate and usher in meaningful change.  If Fred’s story piqued your interest, there are links to the Forbes Fund as well as to a good primer for educating yourself on these issues in the show notes.

2. Be careful what you convey/expect from a leader that is grieving.  Are you expecting them to just keep on churning, without pause?  Fred has a beautiful commitment to his community.  He felt like his accomplishments were not just for him but also for his community.  He felt an expectation of strength and persistence from his community and that messaging kept him (in part) from fully grieving. 

3. We all need a place to grieve and just to be, without an expectation of performance.  Fred talked about feeling compelled to keep our interview date, even with a dozen other pressing commitments.  That having an unbiased listener allowed him to be authentic and courageous.  His words towards me were kind…and this show gives me the opportunity to really listen to a story.  But it can be hard to do in our personal lives, when there are so many demands and questions that we want to ask and subtle agendas or conditioning that keep us from really being available and showing up.  May we be and may we become a safe space for those that make up our community.

Iterating at the Forbes Fund

Resources for further study

Community connections

Everything Fell Apart: Cancer, Miscarriage, Divorce, and Infant Loss. An Interview with Molly Huffman

Molly Huffman, author of The Moon is Round:  A True Story of Extraordinary Loss, Grief, and the Fight for Faith

Sometimes, one loss falls quickly on the heels of the next and it feels like the world is reeling under the weight of your sadness.  In the span of a few short years, Molly Huffman lost her mom, her marriage, and two children. 

In today’s episode, Molly talks about when your biggest fears come true:  the struggle for faith, the importance of friendship, and the choices you face as you live life on the other side.  Molly offers hope and encouragement for going through a season of loss.  Molly is the author of a newly released memoir, The Moon is Round:  A True Story of Extraordinary Loss, Grief, and the Fight for Faith.

You can find the Handle with Care podcast on Spotify, Google Play, and Apple Podcasts. You can listen to the episode here:

The Huffman family eagerly awaits Mack

Here are three take-aways from my conversation with Molly

1. If you know someone that is in an overwhelming, isolating season (particularly with a small child) it can be really helpful to make a schedule of support.  Molly’s friends made sure that she had someone with her….IF she wanted to and they gave her space to cancel at any time.  This sort of consistent, responsive, flexible support can be deeply meaningful. 

2. Molly noted, “Nothing you do or say will ultimately fix the person that is grieving” so release yourself from the pressure of getting it perfect.  Molly appreciated gifts, a hug, and the small gestures of people moving towards her. 

3. Grief can and often will cause you to question what seemed like unshakeable beliefs.  As Molly grew in her practice of faith and her ways of prayer, she benefitted from friends that encouraged her to be open and honest in her questions.  And this open, honest engagement is so important for faith and for life.  Avoiding or stuffing unwieldy emotions is toxic; what we resist persists. 

Molly and Tage

Molly and Mack

My partner is dead: drunk driving and sudden death. An interview with Barry Hoyer

AJ (on the left) and Barry (on the right)

How do you support and come alongside your homosexual/bisexual/queer colleague or friend when they lose a partner or spouse? 

A few months ago, Barry Hoyer lost AJ, the love of his life, when he was struck and killed by a drunk driver. 

Barry was well-supported.  “All of my friends have kind of treated this is like the loss of a husband or a wife, like it has the exact same gravity.”

In this episode of the Handle with Care podcast, Barry shares about AJ, how they met, AJ’s endearing quirks, and what it is like to move through life after unexpected loss.

He also gives voice to what DISH Network is doing to help him as he copes with loss.  From the care of his manager to personal notes from the executives to time off, Barry shares meaningful gestures that make a difference.   

You can find the Handle with Care podcast on Spotify, Google Play, and Apple Podcasts. And you can listen to the episode here:

Here are three take-aways from my conversation with Barry

1. Displays of support in the workplace are so important.  An email sharing a memory, easing the path with HR, or having spaces to take off early if the days gets too overwhelming.  All of these things were deeply impactful for Barry.  As was his overall work context, where his presence as a homosexual man was not something that was an aberration or changes how people showed comfort during his time of loss. 

2. When someone returns to work after a loss, be conservative about big, public shows of comfort.  Barry described how uncomfortable it made him to have a casual coworker publicly draw attention to him and to his loss. 

3. Grief is unpredictable.  Barry describes feeling sad and then happy and then guilty for feeling happy.  If this is you, know that tumultuous emotions are normal. 

Front-line workers & the stress of being essential: an interview with Seth Morales

Seth Morales, CEO Morales Group

Essential workers keep America running:  filling online orders, driving delivery trucks, sustaining supply chains.  In normal times, these men and women often fade into the background.  Seth Morales has worked with and supported these workers for years.  He speaks to the needs, the fears, and the lived realities of those who are sustaining the economy during these uncertain times. 

You can find the Handle with Care podcast on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and Google Play. And you can listen to the episode here:

Here are three takeaways from my conversation with Seth

1. I want to grow in my appreciation of the hourly workers that are keeping our economy running.  They are essential and often overlooked.  In cultivating appreciation, start with something basic:  maybe pausing to give genuine thanks and a good tip to your Instacart shopper or the delivery person.  I hope that this time of need plants seeds of gratitude that continue to bear fruit when our economy is again running at full-steam and these workers could once again fade into the background. 

2. Communication matters.  At the Morales Group, that looks like regular check-ins and avoiding “weasel words”.  Be clear and be human in your communication.  Video communication has the added benefit of truly humanizing your words in a way that email does not.

3. As Seth said, people will remember how you treated them.  Put a radical focus on cultivating empathy and care…and, as Seth mentioned, this oftentimes means leading with your own vulnerability.  What does it look like to be human and vulnerable with the people you interact with today?

“Action is the best way to help”: reform for restaurants in COVID-19. An interview with Serena Suh

Photo by Serena Suh

Do you know someone that has been affected by closures within the food industry?  A chef that has been laid off?  The owner of an area restaurant that has to close her doors?  Your favorite waitress from Café Patachou? 

Do you wonder what this time has been like for him/her and how you could help?

In this episode of the Handle with Care Podcast, Serena Suh shares her story of COVID-19 upheaval within the restaurant industry.  How did it feel to have everything change so quickly?  What is it like to try to get by, even in stable times, on slim margins?  How can you help people that are living in uncertainty?

You can find the Handle with Care podcast on Apple Podcasts, Google Play, and Spotify. And you can listen to the episode here:

Serena Suh

Here are three take-aways from my conversation with Serena:

1. Serena said that “Action is the best way to help people right now.”  Do you love your favorite local restaurant that has had to close?  Do you have a friend that has been impacted by the lay-offs?  Take time to call your representative and say that you care about specific legislation that provides funds and reform to the restaurant industry.  I know that I have called my representatives multiple times over the last few weeks.  After all, that is what they are there for in a representative democracy.  And you can read more in Serena’s article, which I have linked in the show notes.  Taking time to educate yourself about the inequities in the system is its own form of empathy and care.

2. Reach out to those that have been affected.  Serena said how much a call or a text meant. 

3. Send money.  I appreciate that Serena was really up front about how helpful money has been.  Don’t know how to spend your relief payment from the government?  How about sending some of it to the waitress or chef you know that has been laid off?

Image by Serena Suh

Image by Serena Suh

Alcohol, Self-Soothing, & the Coronavirus: an interview with David Mills

David Mills

Alcohol sales are booming nationwide as we look for ways to feel better about the world and about ourselves.  David Mills is a recovering alcoholic, journeying into sobriety during a pandemic.  “There are ways to live into the parts of yourself that you don’t love yet without dulling your senses.”  He offers wisdom and insight for the parts of yourself you feel like you can’t fully live with right now.     

You can find the Handle with Care podcast on Google Play, Apple Podcasts, and Spotify. And you can listen to the episode here:

Here are three reflections after my conversation with David:

1. If you know someone that is living with alcoholism or walking a journey of sobriety, reach out and check in with them.  Social support is especially important for David…and sometimes people in his support network have to reach out more than once.  Practice persistence in your care. 

2. David has been directing his energy into creative outlets like woodworking and reading books that take him to other places.  How can you funnel your feelings into pursuits that are creative and life giving?

3. Who you are with alcohol is not the most interesting part about you.  There is deep wisdom in this reflection. Whether it is alcohol or another coping mechanism to escape pain, remember that you are more than that behavior and that there are other ways to address the pain. 

David in his workshop

COVID-19 and Catering: Insights from the Pirate Ship

Matt Mills, Owner and Chief Pirate at Mills Catering

“Well, for us, it’s kind of like a crew on a pirate ship…we’re all there because we want to be there.”

This is how Matt Mills describes his crew at Mills Catering.  A group of like-minded misfits, united by their love of good service and great food. 

 Like so many in the food and hospitality sector, Mills Catering has been bludgeoned by COVID-19. 

Do you know anyone that works in the restaurant or food industry?  They are struggling, struggling with cancelled events and unpaid bills and layoffs.  What can you do to help?  Matt offers insights into the human cost of the Coronavirus on both him and his staff. 

You can find the Handle with Care Podcast on Google Play, Apple Podcasts, and Spotify. You can also just listen by clicking here

Pork with orange and ancho from Mills Catering

As always, here are three key takeaways from my conversation with Matt Mills

1. I hope this conversation opened you up to one of the stories behind the numbers.  The men and women being affected are not just data points, they are people with families and passion, scrappy entrepreneurs and workers that are feeling this deeply

2. Buy gift cards or order carry-out.  People in the restaurant and food service are doing everything they can to keep their pirate ships afloat…I have linked the Mills Catering Facebook page to the show notes.  This is the best place to keep up with daily menu items and delivery options.  Try the coleslaw

3. I loved Matt’s turn of phrase:  it’s not about what happened, it’s about what happens next.  This is, in a time of great uncertainty, perhaps a good word for everyone.  What happens NEXT for you? 

And for those of you in Indianapolis that want to support Mills Catering, here is a link to their Facebook Page where menus are updated regularly Mills Catering

Living with Depression: an Interview with Paul Ashley

Paul Ashley

“How can you be depressed?  You are the life of the party?”  Paul Ashley has lived in the with the reality of depression as well as people’s misunderstanding of the disease since he was seventeen years old.  Paul speaks about misconceptions and stigma, about feeling overwhelmed and debilitated, and about what helps him to move beyond a depressive season.  His insights as a father, partner, and businessman are both vulnerable and insightful. 

You can find the Handle with Care: Empathy at Work podcast on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and Google Play. And you can listen to the episode here:

Family Shot (not pictured: 3 dogs and a fish)

Here are three take-aways from my conversation with Paul

1. If someone confides in you about their depression, listen and resist the urge to say something that minimizes their disclosure.  Paul was especially triggered by statements like “But you are always so happy!”  Which leads to my second point

2. Depression can take all different forms.  A person that is often “on” in their job function can be absolutely exhausted at home.  Widening our perception of what depression looks like (and how debilitating it can be) will go a long way to breaking down the stigmas that promote a culture of silence. 

3. If you know someone that is struggling with depression, regularly checking in with them can be really important.  Remember, as you make contact with them, they might not respond initially, you might need to continue checking in.  As Paul said, coming alongside them and doing something that they have enjoyed in the past or just showing up to be with them, even if that means not talking for awhile, can powerfully show support. 

Here are links to the resources that Paul mentioned in the episode as well as to his Man of the Year Fundraising Page (you should donate to this good cause; I did!).

Man of the Year Campaign

FirstPerson/Paul Ashley bio page

WHO Black Dog video

Reducing the Stigma, BizVoice Magazine Article

Bryan Brenner and Paul Ashley of First Person

Dissolved Adoption: Shame, Isolation, & Painful Choices. An Interview with Adam and Allie Bryan

The Bryan Family

Do you know someone who is adopting?  Perhaps they are raising money and filling out paperwork.  Maybe they have recently brought their child home.  But what happens when an adoption ends?  When the child that was welcomed into a family is moved to a new home, a new state?  Adam and Allie Bryan talk about the often-overlooked world of dissolved adoptions. 

From the journey to Uganda, the challenge of transition, and the pain of dissolution, Adam and Allie give voice to the heartache, social judgment, isolation, and love that has marked their journey through dissolved adoption.  This discussion is provocative and eye-opening and will help you support adoptive families, no matter where they are in their journey.

You can find the Handle with Care: Empathy at Work podcast on Google Play, Spotify, and Apple Podcasts. You can also listen here…

A Funny Photo

Here are three take-aways from this conversation with Adam and Allie

1. Move towards individuals and families that have experienced a dissolved adoption.  These transitions can be full of a lot of pain.  Give what you can:  a meal, a gift certificate, a house cleaning.  Each gesture matters.

2. Be aware that the family left behind will most likely need help beyond the transition.  Adam, Allie, and their children are still in counseling, processing grief two years after the disrupted adoption.  Ask families how they are doing and offer gestures of support beyond the immediate days and weeks after the transition. 

3. Adoption can be beautiful, complex, and isolating.  Allie and Adam talked about how they felt without resources, like they were silently drowning.  If you have friends who have adopted, reach out, ask them how they are doing, provide a listening ear.  They might be struggling and very much in need of a friend.  Or point them to supportive resources, some of which are available in the show notes.

4. And this is a bonus, fourth take-away.  Adam and Allie described a few people that responded primarily out of their experience:  there was the family who had adopted that could not continue to be in relationship.  The Facebook commenter who was shaped by her own history of abandonment.  We are always responding to other people’s pain out of our own experience.  If this episode was triggering, eliciting strong emotion, take a moment to ask the question of what personal experience you might be living out of in your response. 

Mental Health, Stigma, and Suicide: a Chinese-American Perspective

The Three Ks

Our community and context shape how we respond to challenge and trauma.

As a Chinese-American, Karen Ng has a passion to confront the stigma and discomfort towards mental health and suicide that she encountered.  Two years ago, Karen’s sister, Karine, took her own life. 

Karen speaks to the pain, the feelings of shame, family expectations, and what has helped her to survive and stabilize after loss. 

There are powerful, particular insights into the journey of this Chinese-American, the stigma around counseling and depression, and the ways to create cultures of care and support.

You can find the Handle with Care Podcast on Google Play, Spotify and Apple Podcasts. You can also listen here:

Karine Ng

Here are three key take-aways after my conversation with Karen…

1. Our community helps to shape our reality.  Karen talked about the particular challenges within a Chinese-American community:  the reluctance to seek help for depression or mental illness, the pressure to be strong.  What kind of a culture are you a part of when it comes to grief and loss?  Is it an open one that allows space for those that struggle?  Or is it one that forces people to bury their struggles?  How can you be part of co-creating a more life-affirming culture?

2. In the aftermath of a suicide, loved ones can be unfocused and adrift.  Karen talked about the importance of getting very straightforward directions, taking one project at a time.  For managers or coworkers, be aware of this element of distraction and adjust your workflow accordingly.  Perhaps this means streamlining tasks and having more regular check-ins in those first few months.

3. There is great power and importance to listening to the experience of people that come from a background or context that is different than your own, especially if you are part of a majority culture.  You will not immediately resonate with or understand their perspective…in translating cultures or navigating grief, you will most-likely make mistakes along the way.  If you make a mistake, like I did in referring to Asian-Americans instead of Chinese Americans, accept correction, apologize, and try to modify your perspective moving forwards.

The Ng Family

Growing up together

Living with PTSD: an interview with Elsie Iudicello

Elsie Iudicello

PTSD can be overwhelming and complicated:  panic attacks, uncertainty, and pain crop up suddenly. 

How can you come alongside someone who is living with PTSD?  On today’s episode, Elsie Iudicello shares about her PTSD following a medical accident that left her reeling, coping with pain, triggers and flashbacks.  Elsie is an author, speaker, and the parent of four young boys. 

You can find Handle with Care on Apple Podcasts, Google Play, and Spotify. You can also listen here:

Elsie and her boys

Here are three reflections from my conversation with Elsie

1. If you care for someone that is living with PTSD, choose carefully where you want to push them.  There are concerns, fears, and reactions that will not make logical sense to you.  As Elsie shared, love, listening and support is oftentimes what is needed most

2. In Elsie’s words, is your mouth full of advice or are you ready to listen?  People who were quick to give answers were rarely comforting.  Instead, bring a meal or a book by a favorite author.  Play on the floor with children or just sit in silence.  Laugh with them about old jokes, all of this can be much more meaningful than giving advice. 

3. Elsie talked about how important it was that Jeff did not discount her, even though she was living within a mental struggle.  When you interact with someone living with PTSD, be careful not to quickly write them off, minimizing their concerns with your words or actions.  Remember, someone that is living with PTSD is still themselves, even if they are changed.  What does it look like for you to live within the tension of the person being the same but different?

Elsie, conference speaker